CVL-Caledon Literary Group Transcript for 2020-05-14

Arthur C. Clarke — Wall of Darkness

16:42 Second Life Items successfully shared.
16:50 Solar Sierra Cool. Spoiler alert: I'm going to poof as soon as it gets scary
16:50 Valibrarian Gregg Welcome Solar!
16:51 Solar Sierra Thanks
16:51 Valibrarian Gregg no problem hehe
16:51 Solar Sierra Hello WJ, KC
16:51 Phrynne hello -- waiting for the place to rez
16:51 Solar Sierra Shoot. I heard a noise. Argh. Another time. Good to see you all.
16:53 Valibrarian Gregg Hi all...just seeing if I need to remind anyone
16:53 Valibrarian Gregg and we will start at the top of the hour
16:53 Jaz Beverly Hello!
16:53 KayCooper Hi Jaz
16:53 Valibrarian Gregg welcome Jaz
16:53 Valibrarian Gregg good to see you
16:54 Jaz Beverly and you!
16:54 Wordsmith Jarvinen Hello, Kay and Jaz and Phrynne
16:54 KayCooper Hi Word :)
16:54 KayCooper Hi Phrynne
16:54 Jaz Beverly Hello, neighbors, friends, and all!
16:56 Wordsmith Jarvinen Hi, Solar
16:56 Solar Sierra Hi
16:57 Wordsmith Jarvinen There's a short discussion notecard in the vase in front of me
16:57 KayCooper Hi Peter :)
16:57 Jaz Beverly Everyone have a good day? Any adventures?
16:57 Valibrarian Gregg Welcome Peter :)
16:57 Jaz Beverly Peter!
16:57 Wordsmith Jarvinen Hi, Peter
16:58 Valibrarian Gregg I hope everyone is well! So far so good here :)
16:58 Peter from New York (peterfromnewyork) Hi All
16:58 Solar Sierra Hi
16:58 Valibrarian Gregg To get the discussion notecard- click on the vase in front of Wordsmith if you just arrived.
16:59 Solar Sierra I had a talk with another solar builder and we were concerned with our solar modules here in SL dealing with sunup. That is going to be a problem on this evening's planet.
16:59 Wordsmith Jarvinen The listening link is https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYid_Rb-xCM
16:59 KayCooper Hi Jack
17:00 Peter from New York (peterfromnewyork) whispers: When do we start playing it?
17:00 Valibrarian Gregg Tell us when to start the vintage radio link, Wordsmith!
17:00 Valibrarian Gregg and also....shall we chat during the radio broadcast here in text chat?
17:00 Valibrarian Gregg or wait til after?
17:01 KayCooper Happy to be here :)
17:01 Jaz Beverly Thank you!
17:02 KayCooper Hi Siri
17:02 Solar Sierra I had little trouble on the mountain path to get here.
17:02 Valibrarian Gregg Welcome Siri- we are about to start
17:02 Valibrarian Gregg Did everyone hear me?
17:02 Siri Vezina thanks for the tp - I had the wrong campfire
17:02 Solar Sierra I heard VG
17:02 Valibrarian Gregg We will use text but I just wanted to welcome you!
17:02 Valibrarian Gregg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYid_Rb-xCM
17:03 Valibrarian Gregg if you just arrived
17:03 Jaz Beverly Sounds lovely!
17:03 Peter from New York (peterfromnewyork) all set
17:03 Jaz Beverly Begin audio?
17:03 Valibrarian Gregg We have 2 campfires! glad you found us
17:03 KayCooper I'm ready
17:03 Valibrarian Gregg shall we begin- I am ready
17:03 Wordsmith Jarvinen hit play
17:04 Valibrarian Gregg Here is the link Sitearm https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYid_Rb-xCM
17:04 Valibrarian Gregg we are about to start listening to the story!
17:04 Wordsmith Jarvinen And feel free to comment as we listen
17:04 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) /ao off
17:04 Jack Ryeder (helryeder) i rewind the story
17:04 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) kk
17:04 Valibrarian Gregg okay! I am ready to hit play~
17:04 Jack Ryeder (helryeder) it had auto played on me
17:04 Wordsmith Jarvinen Let's play
17:05 Siri Vezina it came up on Zelazny for me - I thought this was Clarke?
17:05 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) I am ready to hit play as well
17:05 Valibrarian Gregg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYid_Rb-xCM Clarke- Wall of Darkness
17:06 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) so... is there a count down...
17:06 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) eerie space music
17:06 Wordsmith Jarvinen Music to set the mood
17:06 Siri Vezina yep, now I've got it
17:06 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) many are the bubbles....
17:07 Wordsmith Jarvinen The multi-verse -- universes like bubbles in swiss cheese
17:07 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) lol
17:09 Wordsmith Jarvinen Hello, Lightweaver. we are listening to https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k-d38zbxt6o&feature=youtu.be
17:10 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) those wordy philosophers
17:10 Lightweaver Balan xièxiè
17:11 Wordsmith Jarvinen Will curiosity kill the cat?
17:11 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) ah but do we know what we do not know !
17:11 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) erm we do not know what we do not know
17:12 Phrynne this is reminding me of A Canticle for Leibowitz, where nobody knew the origin or the reasons why things were done
17:13 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) cool - I know that title but did not remember the story
17:13 Jack Ryeder (helryeder) i cant wait to listen to this again
17:14 Jack Ryeder (helryeder) this is so intriguing
17:17 Valibrarian Gregg The wall is an intriguing mystery… is the older generation teaching the young?
17:19 Wordsmith Jarvinen Sounds like a good platform for running stadiums.
17:19 Wordsmith Jarvinen Some grow up to have reason ... some ....
17:22 Jaz Beverly Famous last words... "There is nothing to fear!"
17:23 Wordsmith Jarvinen Sometime nothing is a real cool hand -- "Cool hand luke"
17:23 Wordsmith Jarvinen Hi Jmanque
17:23 Wordsmith Jarvinen We are listening to https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYid_Rb-xCM
17:25 Valibrarian Gregg Are there others across the wall? (Could there be life elsewhere?)
17:26 Jaz Beverly The fallacy of sunk cost..."we have come so far..."
17:27 Valibrarian Gregg The far edge! The other side! There may be hope…..and light.
17:27 Peter from New York (peterfromnewyork) It will just take a mythical man month
17:27 Wordsmith Jarvinen We know what cost we've spent, but how much more
17:30 Wordsmith Jarvinen A Mobius strip
17:30 Valibrarian Gregg Our universe comes to an end along the line of the wall- and yet it does not end. A manmade barrier?
17:31 Valibrarian Gregg yes-- A plain sheet of paper with two sides- can you imagine only one side? Bent into a loop- a mobius strip! eternity
17:31 Wordsmith Jarvinen I did say in the notecard that it was a story with a mathematical twist.
17:31 Valibrarian Gregg I see! the mathematical twist!
17:32 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) ahaha Word :)
17:32 KayCooper Quite the twist :)
17:32 Valibrarian Gregg A strange feeling that another identical stairway is on the other side of the wall- reminds me of a Twilight Zone episode (all is a dream or maybe we are just in a doll house or computer program).
17:33 Wordsmith Jarvinen The engineer has this feeling that there is a duplicate platform --- the difficulty in visualizing that one can walk forward and yet end up where one started.
17:33 KayCooper This story has a Twilight Zone feel to it
17:33 Wordsmith Jarvinen A bit, yes
17:34 Valibrarian Gregg ooh there is more! I thought it was over
17:34 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) cast credits
17:34 Jack Ryeder (helryeder) infinity is our symbol
17:34 Wordsmith Jarvinen I think it's just duplicate recording.
17:34 KayCooper Yeah, it sounds the same
17:34 Solar Sierra The cast credits are the mirrorwall here
17:34 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) lol
17:34 Valibrarian Gregg exactly! hahah
17:35 KayCooper I guess I can see why they said people who see it go mad
17:35 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) /me wonders if they did that on purpose
17:35 KayCooper They can't wrap their minds around it
17:35 Valibrarian Gregg We are on a Mobius strip!
17:35 Solar Sierra Can anyone place TOO high a price?
17:35 Wordsmith Jarvinen Perhaps they built the wall so that people didn't go back and forth until they went mad.
17:36 Jack Ryeder (helryeder) we shall experience the wall
17:36 KayCooper It's a sanity wall :)
17:36 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) The title Wall of Darkness by Clarke reminds me of the title Nightfall by Asimov
17:36 Jack Ryeder (helryeder) lol Kay that is Madness don't scare our visitor
17:36 Jaz Beverly The constant use of the term "visitor" seemed to indicate a culture more at home with the familiar.
17:36 KayCooper hehe
17:36 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) both have someone go mad having mindset being blown up
17:36 Valibrarian Gregg A container wall (reminds me of the movie Truman Show where Jim Carey finds out he is living in a simulation)
17:37 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) ooh good one val
17:37 Jaz Beverly Yes! The Truman Show!
17:37 Wordsmith Jarvinen Our minds learn to perceive a certain type of 3-d reality.
17:37 Valibrarian Gregg He, too, had that curiosity to keep looking
17:37 Solar Sierra They need this LSL scripting page: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/LlEdgeOfWorld
17:38 Valibrarian Gregg and our minds make up "pseudo concepts" to fill in the gaps in our knowledge.
17:38 Wordsmith Jarvinen There's legitimate speculation about whether we might be in a simulation. Lisa Randall rates it as unlikely. Tyson 50:50.
17:38 Jaz Beverly lol, great LSL reference
17:38 Valibrarian Gregg We "decide" what is real, right? And we all know sitting around this campfire is real...because WE are real
17:39 Phrynne A simulation, or a 3D representation of a 4D universe?
17:39 Phrynne just as this is a 2D version of a 3D one?
17:39 KayCooper We could be 3D simulations that forgot we had 4D typists
17:39 Solar Sierra There is no agency in a material world. How could a "decision" be made when the action is according the sum of the forces, or the least energy?
17:40 Jaz Beverly I have been trying to describe to colleagues at work how meeting in a virtual world feels vastly different than being on video calls.
17:40 Valibrarian Gregg Our metamodern era promotes hyperreality- a state in which the simulacra becomes the real (icons, representations)
17:40 Solar Sierra We have much less expressive faces and more expressive spaces
17:40 Jaz Beverly But is impossible to explain virtual worlds -- a shared alternate reality, without the experience of them
17:40 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) nice one solar
17:40 Wordsmith Jarvinen We learn to interpret what we see, in terms of experience. Objects get smaller with distance, hence perspective drawing.
17:40 Valibrarian Gregg true Jaz- images and machinima of SL do not do it justice (you gotta be there to know what it feels like)
17:41 Jaz Beverly Here, here, Solar! Well put.
17:41 Solar Sierra The way I will explain this side of the wall from now on is that downloading an app "is the first step on the way to understanding."
17:41 Jaz Beverly Yes! And the live sharing of a virtual space is a unique way of gathering.
17:42 Wordsmith Jarvinen It gives a sense of proximity without requiring travel.
17:42 Valibrarian Gregg absolutely- a shared space
17:42 KayCooper I think sharing a virtual space feels more communal than a bunch of video chat windows
17:42 Jaz Beverly I would rather be limited to interacting in open sims and SL than limited to only video call connections
17:42 Solar Sierra I missed some story. Who is the platform engineer?
17:43 Jaz Beverly The one who created a way to surmount the seemingly insurmountable wall.
17:43 Valibrarian Gregg Yes Solar- I am not sure either....and the question about how the platform engineer feels at the end?
17:43 Wordsmith Jarvinen The one at the end, who doesn't want to watch the platform being destroyed, and imagines that perhaps there's a duplicate platform that will come down at the same time.
17:44 jmanque Must go, it's been fun :)
17:44 Jack Ryeder (helryeder) but what if we were stuck here in this city unable to explore
17:44 KayCooper I'm bad at remembering characters when I hear them but don't read them
17:44 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) Vihart the YouTube vlogger has done two interesting Moebius strip posts - one is a Moebius punch strip for a music box
17:44 Solar Sierra Oh, yeah, thanks, WJ, heard him.
17:44 Valibrarian Gregg good to see you jmangue
17:44 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) plays a harry potter theme continuously
17:44 Wordsmith Jarvinen How he feels, alludes the his sense of duplicates.
17:45 Solar Sierra One would need a good fugue that worked upside down.
17:45 Wordsmith Jarvinen The "I can't help but imagine another wall will fall on the other side"
17:45 Wordsmith Jarvinen Mozart did that.
17:45 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) the other ViHart is a story like Wall drawn upon a transparent Moebius strip but you don't realize that until the end : )
17:45 Jack Ryeder (helryeder) he did?
17:46 Valibrarian Gregg the sense of balancing the universe
17:46 Solar Sierra There are plenty of fugues with motifs turned upside down, but the entire thing inverted?
17:47 Jaz Beverly I like the juxtaposition of the balanced and quirky/unique. Good to have both.
17:47 Valibrarian Gregg And- what about the planet always facing the sun? Our world is built on the spiral- the movement of spinning and polarities that brings (hot, cold- night , day)
17:47 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) @Solar here is a paper on that canon thing
17:47 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) http://vihart.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/Vi-Hart-ESMA2010-Music-Box.pdf
17:47 Solar Sierra TX
17:47 Jaz Beverly Yes, that was the hardest part of the story for me to imagine -- a sun that stayed fixed in the sky
17:47 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) shows the Moebius twist of the music : )
17:48 Valibrarian Gregg Why did Clarke create a place that seemed "one-sided"- facing one way? To make us think about the other side of the twisted strip?
17:48 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) he was messing with our minds ?
17:48 Jaz Beverly And the people were stuck unable to move along the strip.
17:48 Valibrarian Gregg Cool Sitearm- is this the Moebius music video? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3iMI_uOM_fY&list=PLEC77462F1ECB5D3E&index=1
17:48 Wordsmith Jarvinen It made for a good mystery situation, and a bit of fascination with Moebius strips.
17:49 Jaz Beverly The sun didn't move, the people didn't move, but all balanced on a fluid shape
17:49 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) yes val : )
17:49 Valibrarian Gregg And who is the visitor? Was he the one who brought the curiosity? Someone had to think outside the box
17:50 Wordsmith Jarvinen A world that rotates at the same speed it goes around its sun --- gravity locked.
17:50 Solar Sierra But a Moebius strip has two sides, out of phase. When the ant goes over the edge, it ends up facing the opposite direction. That is a different side.
17:50 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) @Val I assume the Visitor is Us the readers - for us to be immersed in the story
17:50 Jaz Beverly I wonder if it is meant to draw attention to the artificial nature of walls like the Berlin wall -- or any time humans attempt to draw limiting borders on an interconnected universe.
17:50 Valibrarian Gregg oh yes! we come to visit the wall ;)
17:50 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) @Solar that ant will have invented FTL!
17:50 Valibrarian Gregg good point, Jaz- the idea of the boundary of the wall
17:50 Wordsmith Jarvinen I think "the visitor" was part of the adaptation to make it a viable radio story.
17:51 Jaz Beverly The Visitor also reflects a cultural wall -- us and them
17:51 Lightweaver Balan /me bows
17:51 Jaz Beverly Someone who is never given a name, goes by status of the other
17:52 Valibrarian Gregg great Jaz! I did feel an "us and them" feeling (made me think of aliens out there on other planets maybe)
17:52 Solar Sierra Did the visitor speak? If not, then maybe it was the female actor who always gets paid much less.
17:52 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) @Jaz the story is from 1949; Berlin wall was 60's-80's
17:52 Valibrarian Gregg haha Solar!
17:52 Wordsmith Jarvinen I don't recall the visitor being there when I read the written story years ago.
17:52 Jack Ryeder (helryeder) we were the visitor i thought
17:52 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) @Word dunno however the description does say this is a radio play adaptation
17:52 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) @Jack me too
17:53 Valibrarian Gregg Wordsmith- one of your questions: A prince with a curiosity to know the answer and the resources to attempt to find out. (Is that the child?)
17:53 Jaz Beverly True, Sitearm, but I just meant borders in general. Sorry, was just trying to pull in an example of one less likely to be politically polarizing than walls along current borders.
17:53 Wordsmith Jarvinen The child who grew up to be the one to cross the wall with the "visitor"
17:53 Jack Ryeder (helryeder) they brought us to the edge and they fell over into the cold]
17:54 Jack Ryeder (helryeder) im guessing the void
17:54 Valibrarian Gregg A "quest" to understand- a coming of age story within
17:54 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) Jaz :)
17:54 Jaz Beverly Children -- curious and less worried about transgressing cultural norms they may not see or be as attached to as the adults.
17:54 Valibrarian Gregg exactly Jaz
17:54 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) was in a class last month where we read a sci-fi story that was directly tied to the events of the time
17:54 Wordsmith Jarvinen Curiosity set in motion as a child, and not killed while growing up.
17:54 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) the prof made a big deal on it lol
17:55 Valibrarian Gregg A child pointed out the Emperor's new clothes...there is an honesty in them
17:56 Jaz Beverly I think as adults one of our biggest challenges is to continue to look, explore, re-examine even that which we think we know.
17:56 Solar Sierra There are animals too. http://www.animalcognition.org/2015/04/15/list-of-animals-that-have-passed-the-mirror-test/
17:56 Jaz Beverly The more certain we are, the more we should be questioning.
17:56 Valibrarian Gregg yes Jaz- a willingness to question ourselves
17:57 Valibrarian Gregg cool link Solar...the mirror test reminds me of looking into the wall
17:58 Valibrarian Gregg I really liked listening to this story....great way to be "immersed" together here. TY Wordsmith! You pick good ones.
17:58 Jack Ryeder (helryeder) nice to meet u all
17:58 KayCooper That was a good one
17:58 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) Solar :) mirror test
17:58 KayCooper They've all been good though
17:58 Jack Ryeder (helryeder) *shakes hands
17:58 Peter from New York (peterfromnewyork) Thanks for a fun event
17:59 Valibrarian Gregg Our next literary study will be on June 11th and we will meet over at Caledon :) We alternate monthly
17:59 Valibrarian Gregg June 11 at 5pm
17:59 Jaz Beverly Thank you all so much. Wonderful story and discussion!
17:59 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) @All you might enjoy this short vid also moebius ViHart
17:59 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4mdEsouIXGM
17:59 Valibrarian Gregg TY Sitearm!
18:00 Valibrarian Gregg bookmarking video!
18:00 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) de nada... or de rien...
18:00 Sitearm (sitearm.madonna) @Val ty for the event @All ty for your camaraderie and conversation see you soon
18:00 Valibrarian Gregg TY all for coming and hope to see you next time :)
18:00 Wordsmith Jarvinen Vi Hart has a whoe series of videos on doodling while in math class.
18:00 Peter from New York (peterfromnewyork) Stay Safe!
18:00 KayCooper Thank you!
18:00 Phrynne Good to see you all again
18:01 Valibrarian Gregg Wordsmith- let me know the story for June and we will head to Stonesedge Outdoor Meeting Center
18:01 Wordsmith Jarvinen tc, Til again
18:01 Jaz Beverly Have a lovely evening!
18:01 Valibrarian Gregg Good night everyone :) wherever you may be
18:01 KayCooper Good morning, good evening, or good night :)
18:01 Wordsmith Jarvinen Dance then, wherever you may be ......
18:01 Solar Sierra GN all